Four cyclists killed in car crash

[John Moore]

Four cyclists, including a 14-year-old boy, have been killed after a driver lost control of his car on an icy north Wales road on Sunday morning. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/north_west/4592412.stmThoughts are with the families

[Tom Staniford]

My heart goes out to all those affected by the incident- especially the Dad. Terrible.

[Harry Palmer]

My thoughts are with the family and friends of those involved.

[num kok]

awful, awful newscondolencesdave

[Adam Minshull]

I'm dumb with shock. I live in Prestatyn and whilst not a member this morning I passed the pub in Rhuddlan where Rhyl meet. I had intended to stop and wait for the club run but as I was about 15 mins early and as no one was there and it was freezing I decided to plow on on my own. My heart felt condolences go out to the families involved.

[A-M Mac]

such a tragedy,cant imagine how the families of those involved are feeling, my thoughts are with them.

[Rob7]

My deepest sympathies to the families and friends & to all those with the cycling club - so very tragic

[Johnboy]

Absolute tragedy. Deepest sympathies to all families and friends involved.

[James Warrener]

A terrible accident and a waste of life. My thoughts are with the families.

[ian emmerson]

what a tragic waste of lives.my sympathies go out to the families.

[Tillytubby]

heart breaking deepest sympathies to all affected by this awful tragedy.

[Stephen Hall]

Shocking news. My family and i give our heartfelt and deepest sympathies to all those involed.

[Jez Spencer]

My sympathy to all involved in such a tragic accident.

[Grant Drummond]

I heard about this on the news and have read the articles in the various papers this morning - I am totally shocked and can't seem to concentrate on anything without thinking about how sad this unfotunate event is and the level of dispair the families of these people must be feeling right now, they have my absolute sympathy and condolences

[Julian Hough]

Deepest sympathy to the families and friends of all those touched by this tragedy.

[Arthur Heaton]

We were riding ourselves at the time and mobile phones started to ring from various relatives once news has broken. At the moment it appears to be a terrible accident with no-one to blame, there but for the grace of god..... Deepest Heartfelt sympathy to the families of lost ones

[James Stout (defrosting)]

scary thought as i ama lways the one who corners on the wrong side in a club run... Condolences to all it could so easily of been any of us a sad start to 2006 after an incident filled 2005

[tony coates]

We need to nominate a day where every cycling group in the country can dedicate its Sunday run/event to our friends at Rhyl.

[James Stout (defrosting)]

we should maybe use this as a chance to set up a foundation or something in their memory to help young cyclists? We could all donate at our next club run or something, a fitting memorial i know if our club run got knocked down would appreciate a cycling memorial..

[carl taylor]

my deepest sympathy to all the famlies and members of ryhl cycling club who have been affected by this awful tragedy .

[Duncan Manuel]

How many of us were out on Sunday morning? There but for the grace of God go all of us.My heart goes out to the families.

[Arthur Heaton]

It would be nice to organise something RCUK ?

[Guy Andrews]

Yes perhaps we should, but these things are best led by the friends and family of the club when they are ready. Obviously we'll do all we can to help promote, whatever it is. For the time being let's make sure we all wear an armband on Sunday.

[Arthur Heaton]

A charity memorial ride, maybe with proceeds going to the families would be nice.

[ian emmerson]

I`m in favour of an annual charity memorial ride with proceeds going to the families of every cyclist killed on our roads.This sad tragedy should not be put to one side and forgotten.We should stand up and demand tougher speed restrictions on our roads especially on notorious black spots,because i think we as cyclists take our lives in our own hands each time we go out.

[James Stout (defrosting)]

this wasn't cause dby speeding although many accidents are. This was caused by (it seems) no gritting. Another major cause of accidents is lorry drivers getting very tired. Now is not the time to use this to make a point this was an accident and nobodies fault.

[Rob Davis]

another forum has mentioned wearing black armbands on your next/sunday club run as a mark of respect

[tony coates]

quote another forum has mentioned wearing black armbands on your next/sunday club run as a mark of respect" Yes that is all that is needed, but also let your local TV and paper know that you are doing it and why. Tell them that it is happening across the country.Tony"

[nobby]

This was terrible news. My condolences to all involved. Please take a look at some of the letters posted by readers to the Times", makes me sick! It's about time all cyclists stood up to the motoring lobby. Every time we take to the roads we are in danger, most motorists have not respect for speed or other road users, WE need to be counted, and STAND UP for our rights. Let's show our support and respect for our fellow riders by wearing armbands and maybe setting up a fund for those affected. A terrible day."

[james smith]

Jan:10 Showing supportSeveral of the cycling websites are suggesting that anyone out on a bike this coming weekend might like to show support for the families of the cyclists from Rhyl CC who were killed last weekend on a ride in North Wales. Something as simple as a black armband made from a bit of insulating tape will suffice. Keep safe out there folks.

[James Stout (defrosting)]

i wrote tot he times in response but no luck, maybe we could do a mass letter thingy?

[Duncan Manuel]

James,I am sure that if someone wrote an appropriate letter, posted it on this site (perhaps as a new thread) so that people could review it, we could then indicate our signature to it as a reply.Give it a day or two, collate the signatures and then forward on to The Times.

[James Stout (defrosting)]

ok might get onto that anyone is welcome to have a go

[Bill Shakeshaft]

Not seen the letters in The Times , what was said ?

[tony coates]

Go here http://www.timesonline.co.uk/and type - cycling - into the search criteria, you will find more than enough to make your blood boil.Interested in the three abreast time trials, is this a new catagory?

[Bill Shakeshaft]

Tony , thanks . Now wish I hadn't read them though , some of the letters are extremely worrying .

[Arthur Heaton]

It's disturbing how the general public view roads as being for the sole purpose of the Motor vehicle.I understand when the first car took to the road it had to have a man walking in front of it with a flag !!!!.

[Arthur Heaton]

For those who haven't seen it, this is the 'best'Sir, Why, at a time when the roads are fast and busy and the car industry continues to make faster cars for semi-educated boy racers, do we encourage people to take to the outdated bicycle? Like the horse before it, the cycle is an unpredictable toy not suited to the present day. If bicycles are to be the future, and I seriously doubt they will be, then they should be taxed and licensed and the revenue used to build safe, separate paths. WTF ARE WE UP AGAINST WITH KNOBS LIKE THIS !!

[Tom Staniford]

tosser. Pardon my language.

[Pauly]

Unfortunately, the tosser in question is not unique.

[nobby]

It would be great if all cyclists got RESPECT in this Country, BUT I don't think it will happen! Too many p___ks on the roads in their tin cans! I'm fed up with all this anti-bike feeling in the press and from general public. OK, some riders break the law, ride on pavements(safer??), have no lights etc, but ask yourself, how many people are killed by cyclists? How many motorists, ( that includes ones who cycle!), BREAK THE LAW EVERY DAY? I can't count the number of near misses I've had, overtaking motorists coming straight at me at speed, doors opening, being cut up etc, etc, even when wearing Cipolini kit they still can't SEE ME! today I even had a POLICE CAR pull out across my right of way! WE NEED TO STAND UP TO ALL THIS, it's about time we had a common voice. WE NEED TO BECOME POWERFUL! Anyway, enough of my ranting! I will be wearing a black arm band this weekend in respect to our dead brothers. Condolences to all concerned, must be a nightmare.

[tony coates]

I like to go out on a Sunday morning at 6:30, thats a good two hours before Dawn up here in the north east.At my front I have two S-Sun LED lamps, at the rear I have one S-Sun led lamp plus two bar end flashers (drop handle bars).It confuses the hell out of car drivers on the unlit roads around here, so they slow down and give a wide berth.Even when it is light I leave the rear lights on in flashing mode.As a car driver the more I can see a rider, the more I can give way. But unfortunately there are those about that beleive bikes should not use the road, and there are those too busy on their mobile phones to notice you. I believe that a driver will only risk a squeeze if he thinks it can be done, I make sure that if a squeeze is immenent, that a driver cant try to squeeze through, it would require them to hit me from the rear, I dont believe that any driver would take that risk.I like to use defensive riding. I will not use the gutter, I give myself at least three feet to the curb, so that I can use it if I need it, and give way when I feel it is safe to do so.A blast from a horn is responded by a friendly wave, as if I know them. After 38 years, I am still there with no helmet, and no accidents with car drivers. My problem is with councils that put post in the middle of cycle paths to prevent cars from using them. After a period of time galvanised metal takes on the colour of tarmac. broken noses, cracked ribs cant be protected by helmets.

[Arthur Heaton]

In light of the terrible catastrophe that occurred last Sunday in North Wales in which four cyclists from Rhyl Cycling Club lost their lives, the word is spreading through the cycling world that as a mark of respect to the riders and to their families left behind, that all cyclists that take to the roads on Sunday 15th January 2005, either in group clubruns as the Rhyl CC did, or on their own, as so many do every weekend, that people could wear a black armband . It doesn't have to be ornate, indeed black tape would suffice, anything to show that our thoughts are with them.Extract taken from another websiteCyclists all round the country have been rocked by this accident as we all feel so vulnerable on the roads anyway with increasing traffic volume, we all go out on group rides and the thoughts of most riders with which I have spoken is that it could so easily have been them." Bradley Wiggins and the Cofidis team will be wearing armbands this Sunday. "

[Arthur Heaton]

A letter sent to another tosser writing for the Daily mail.Dear Mr. Tozer I read your Daily Mail report with a great sadness. The pictures were most graphic and could not fail to convey the horror of this incident to all readers of the Daily Mail. I have forwarded to you an E Mail from which you will see that there is to be an approach to the press and others to publicise cyclists tribute to the Rhyl CC members who were killed in this accident. As a lifelong very experienced cyclist and company car driver, I know full well the dangers now increasing on the roads on which we ride. These are increased by the lack of respect many car and lorry drivers have for other road users. Ask pedestrians, horse riders and motor cyclists and they will tell you the same. I feel the latter paragraphs in your report were biased towards the motorist - many motorists have misgivings about how much consideration big groups of club riders give to fellow road users" . I think you will find that big groups of club riders are quite rare nowadays, most riders being in small groups for safety reasons. However, even getting past these is seen as a challenge by some drivers. Most club cyclists could keep you up all night telling of how they have been carved up or knocked off by impatient and inconsiderate drivers. Some, with increasing regularity, killed. It is not more cycle paths we need. What we need is an immediate change of attitude by drivers of all vehicles. A National campaign to educate the vehicle driving masses that other people count on our roads as well as them. Any cyclist who has ridden anywhere abroad will tell you that, generally, there is a greater respect for cyclists so that's why our casualty rates per mile may be higher. I could go on and on but I'm just an ordinary bloke who rides a bike to keep fit and healthy. You will find that club cyclists, like me are a friendly and very intelligent bunch and a pleasure to be with. What a pity that we have to put up with drivers who show little or no respect for our safety. Fancy a nice ride with coffee and cake thrown in. Give me a ring on .......(Number supplied) I'll make sure you don't get knocked off!! Cheers and best wishes. See what you can do for us. "

[nobby]

Great letter from Arthur, well done! It would be great if it made a difference. To get a change of attitude would be difficult, many drivers are self-centred and belive that they own" the road.What we need is a STRONG main cycling body who will STAND UP for our rights, we need someone on our side.Still, nothing will stop me ridin. This Country is not really interested in alternative transport, the road loby is too powerful and all the main political parties are too weak to loose votes over this. All the main political parties are only interested in the short term."

[James Stout (defrosting)]

look at reclaim the streets...