New SRAM

[Bruce Woodhouse]

Interesting 'review' but some pretty sweeping statements after 2 hours riding. I wonder if you've been sucked in by the hype just a tad.Like 'try them and you will convert'. And to be fair to Shimano I was not aware users were 'always struggling' with the flipper design.So the hoods are comfy, the system is light, and it works slightly differently. not cheap which is a bold move by SRAM to go straight for the higher end mnmarket.Perhaps full conclusions would be better after a really good test though, not least about durability which was an issue with X-9 and X-0 SRAM MTB groupsets I've used.I cannot wait for the endless Shim v Cam v SRAM threads from now on....

[Guy Andrews]

It is good and it didn't take long to work that out. But as I said I do have reservations about some of the group components (front mech and brakes). However Shimano should be worried, there is far more in ergonomic advances here, which makes flippers seem prehistoric and cumbersome in comparison. And they are a LOT lighter and less complicated.I did say that I'd like to live with it a bit longer, but for a first attempt SRAM have done well, they deserve credit for that...

[Bruce Woodhouse]

Thanks for the reply Guy. First impressions count, not least in the shop when this starts to become OEM fitted. However at this price level it has to last too. That is what will make or break sales after the buzz has subsided perhaps.

[Mike_B]

Are the levers likely to be compatible with the Shimano 10sp groupsets?

[Guy Andrews]

Yes, Shimano 10 but not Campag 10.My initial feeling is use the levers and mechs combined with some snazzy cranks and brakes... could save loads of weight (if this is an issue to you).It should last well too (drivetrain is essentially sedis/sachs) and the levers are fully re-buildable unlike Shimano. OK there is always a lot of hype from SRAM, but if they can back it up with good after sales service the extra cost will be justified.I would like to see a 105/Centaur price group though.

[Adam Tranter]

So, I would be able to use the SRAM levers with my Shimano Ultegra 10 groupset?

[Guy Andrews]

No. Just the cassette and chain.You'll need new shifters and levers, perhaps I've made a mess of trying to make this clear...

[Mike_B]

Sorry Guy but I'm even more confused!Are you saying that the SRAM levers are NOT compatible with Shimano front or rear mechs but they ARE compatible with a Shimano cassette and a Shimano chain?

[glen smart]

Do you mean that the SRAM levers/shifters will work with the Shimano front mech and derailleur? At least this would allow riders to benefit from the improved ergonomics.I'll be looking at the 2007 Tiagra groupset when it comes out later this year. Hope it's based on the old 9-speed Dura-Ace/Ultegra/105!

[m@]

Sram is 1:1 pull ratio, so it won't work with Shimano mechs.Another thing to note is that the Force is about 125% the price of D-A and Rival 118% of Ultegra (72% of D-A).... quite pricy I'd say!There was also the problem that I heard about if you're in 1st year and you try to go lower, if the shifter doesnt engage the 2nd click (which wont be possible in that gear) then it may end up dropping down a gear instead.

[m@]

Oh and another thing, there's nothing wrong with the Shimano cables, it's somewhere to rest your thumb!

[Guy Andrews]

SRAM shifters and levers are compatible with Shimano chains and cassettes, but not Shimano derailleurs and levers. So you can't mix gear controls, only the drive parts (chains and cassettes). Clear? Thought not.Matt I'm not sure about your pricing, I think it will actually be a bit less than that.Aesthetically there is a lot wrong with Shimano cables IMO, and I think Shimano would prefer a cleaner solution too...I'm going for a lie down now...

[Steve Austin]

'ahem' emperors new clothes 'ahem'

[Guy Andrews]

oh I really don't know why I bother....

[m@]

Well, I did get those prices of WW, but I didn't check to see if I quoted the Force one correctly.Nowt wrong with a few cables here and there.

[glen smart]

The SRAM three cogs downshifting in one action does make sense though. Three actions and you go from 10th to 1st. Could be particularly useful when approaching a steep incline just after a tight bend!

[m@]

That's just like shimano.

[glen smart]

i thought shimano only downshifted two cogs in one action, or at least with the cheaper groupsets such as Sora!

[Andy Corso]

I think at the very least it will shake up the Shimano/Campag camps.... we're seeing the benefits in the MTB world where Shimano are having to make their products more innovative + much more compatible, due I believe, to the impact that SRAM are having... just ny tuppence halfpenny

[Nick Evans]

I agree with Matt re cables, I quite like the Shimano ones being outside the tape, as he says it gives you somewhere to put your thumbs, lets you use an 'indicator' on the cable, and means you can change cables without needing to retape bars everytime.I think that stuff's quite pretty, I like the idea of saving weight, but I'm not too keen on the idea of the shifters, sounds to me like they're addresing a problem that doesn't really exist!

[Guy Swarbrick]

I quite like the external cables, too - handy as a sort of 'Spinaci' substitute.Having recently converted to Campy Record after years of Shimano Ultegra and Dura Ace levers I have to say that not only did I never struggle with the 'flipper' but I'd go back tomorrow. The Campy stuff is prettier and easier to adjust (but it needs to be because it is so much less precise) but the Shimano ergonomics/feel/quality are way, way better than Campagnolo.In fact - weight aside - I'd swap my Record gruppo for 10 speed Ultegra without blinking an eye.Guy

[Martin Scott]

I would like to see an RCUK comparative review of top line groupsets. Everyone seems to have a (subjective) view.

[Guy Swarbrick]

It would be interesting, but it'd be tough to be anything other than subjective - even in a side-by-side review. You could devise some tests for key parameters shifting speed/precision, braking performance etc - as well as the obvious stuff like weight but I suspect if you picked 3 different testers you'd get four different winners... :)

[leon iannarelli]

i just read the sram test yikes we have riddin one of these puppies I wounder what group he was testing. Intuitive not so clunky yes front shifter slow one lever doing the two different differnt funtion ???????????? I guess if you did not race and had all day to make a shiftthis would be a good group on a positive note group is very lite and kool looking